De-Gendering Capricorn and Stellium Hot Takes - Astrology Hotline

Episode 24

De-Gendering Capricorn and Stellium Hot Takes

Published on: 26th July, 2022

Why is Capricorn considered "Daddy Energy" when it is a Feminine sign? Is it bad if I don't Have a Stellium? Bonnie of the Starsdance Mystery School joins the show and lends her Capricorn rising and Stellium credentials to answer these questions and more.

Bonnie May: Instagram - Twitter - Stardance Mystery School

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https://kylepierceastrologer.com

Be sure to check out Wandering Stars, a new podcast hosted by astrologers Kyle Pierce and Ada Pembroke.

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Transcript
Kyle Pierce:

Hello and welcome to astrology hotline podcast where we answer all your burning birth chart and astrology questions. Joining me today is Bonnie blue Bonnie. Hello. And yeah, we're gonna

Bonnie May:

Yeah. Yeah, I've been. I've been feeling pretty. It's conflicting because I feel kind of like not my not myself right now. And at the same time, I'm also like, really happy because I just

Kyle Pierce:

Yeah. Now we have very Mercury charts. Like we have everything in like their opposite or the same sign or the opposite house. But yeah, probably ended up getting hit by the same transits

Bonnie May:

You're my astrology dark twin, because we have, like, Sun Moon and rising.

Kyle Pierce:

Yeah, I the mercury station direct. And Taurus is exactly conjunct my natal mercury. Oh, no, I was eyeballing that for months before. And I was like, what's it going to be?

Bonnie May:

What is it? Yeah,

Kyle Pierce:

is it because mercury, you know, rules my third house. And third house is like, communications and, and podcasts and writing and in sort of day to day routine stuff. But it also

Bonnie May:

But I feel like when Mercury goes direct, there's like this weird period of like, Mercury is kind of like, drunk and like, slow. Yeah, I'm feeling that right now. But yeah, I am

Kyle Pierce:

bite me? Yeah. Oh, yeah, I know. That's what gets gets into Gemini and stuff still in the shadow. Yeah. I ended up starting a podcast though. We recorded the first episode totally on

Bonnie May:

think that's a good sign. Yeah.

Kyle Pierce:

But yeah, it was weird when cuz Saturn station retrograde like the day or it had been station for a good week, but it went retrograde like the day after Mercury station direct. And they

Bonnie May:

Yeah, it's like a standoff. Yeah. Like next time? Yeah. Yeah, giving you a firm warning, and then

Kyle Pierce:

that'll be a try next time? I guess. So.

Bonnie May:

Yeah. That's, that's nice.

Kyle Pierce:

Well, um, do we want to just get started with our first question for today is let's go feel like you're a good one for this as a Capricorn rising. Our first question comes from James in

Bonnie May:

Yeah, I feel so as like a feminine identifying person and a Capricorn rising. I don't feel very daddy energy. I feel more like, people keep giving me stuff to do and I'm tired, but I

Kyle Pierce:

Yeah. Well, they, they are, they definitely have been historically especially. And it's funny because I've been thinking about this a lot since I was invited to do a talk for Symposium on

Bonnie May:

I think I've seen the third one. But it's been a long time. Yeah, I may or may not remember.

Kyle Pierce:

I'm gonna butcher the name. I can never remember names. Hate it. But was it L or 11?

Bonnie May:

l 11. URL. And

Kyle Pierce:

the kid that she had a boyfriend? Yeah, my romance. Mike. Mike. I think it's Mike. Yeah. Well, they are. You know, it's at the point in the show where they're SPOILER ALERT again, but

Bonnie May:

Yeah. What is it? No, I don't remember. It was like a weird, cool nickname, but I don't

Kyle Pierce:

recall exactly. It's such a broken name.

Bonnie May:

So people that are strange people that are Stranger Things fans right now are probably yelling at us right now.

Kyle Pierce:

I know. It's the thing. It's my greatest. Like, it's my greatest weakness. Now I have many. But I can I can just number a room of names. Even a people like say directors that I like,

Bonnie May:

But considering his a cop, and he's

Kyle Pierce:

got a lot working against them in terms of emotional intelligence. But he really was like, starting to lose it with the making out all the time in the room. And he was talking to kind

Bonnie May:

Is it Mike's mom?

Kyle Pierce:

Not Mike's mom, but Winona Ryder. Yes. Joyce? Joyce. All right. Anyway, Jim, Jim Hopper, right. Hoppers for the call. Yeah, he's like talking to Winona Ryder. Joyce, about the

Kyle Pierce:

Daddy energy and the even need to define what dad or daddy energy is. I think it means different things to different people.

Bonnie May:

Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, I feel that because with Capricorn, yeah, is ruled by Saturn. And like, you know, it's like totally opposite of cancer, which is about like, being comfortable

Kyle Pierce:

Yeah, and I I don't know. And I think Nguyet speaks to like the sort of cloistering that we can fall into in the world now. Like, where we don't sort of get settled in our own sort of

Kyle Pierce:

it because it's like their inclination.

Bonnie May:

Yeah, I think kids in general, like, they want to express their emotions, whether there's like they're angry, or they're sad, or, and I tend to, like follow a lot of like, accounts

Bonnie May:

hug your your friends or anything? Oh, yeah. Yeah, things are changing.

Kyle Pierce:

When I was like, I mean, we're 90s kids. So like, yeah, I feel like I was like, halfway indoctrinated with that, or like, that was the message I got, basically, but But anyway, back to the

Kyle Pierce:

think, Okay, this is it. And that's thinking about the kids hugging each other and stuff is like, that's really lovely that like, yeah, if you don't tell them otherwise, they will just express their

Kyle Pierce:

wall. And yeah, and just thinking about it in terms of feminine signs, like and I think it actually ends up being a really good example of how how it doesn't really work very well. A lot of the time

Kyle Pierce:

And he basically was saying that the feminine is wet and masculine is dry. It's kind of like his reasoning for it. But then when you look at like temperament models, birth is dry and cool, cold.

Bonnie May:

So Earth and fire would be dry so masculine and then air and water, which are wet would be feminine. Okay. Interesting.

Kyle Pierce:

Yeah. And honestly, when I think about it, like Air sign people seem I don't know, I guess when I'm thinking about in those terms, like that's the way that I conceive, tend to perceive

Bonnie May:

Yes. Very confrontational. Yeah, it's making me think about how how I feel like gender is like one of those things where it's really hard to define for anyone I feel like it's more easily

Bonnie May:

being rational and like not being biased by emotions or feelings or anything like that. And then, with a lot of the women, identifying people I know, that are air signs. It's more like, oh, I want

Kyle Pierce:

Yeah. Well, that's it got me thinking about air signs differently because of that wetness, that quality of wetness. And while I tried to create like this table of like, okay, which

Bonnie May:

Yeah, it's a little more detached from like, like the raw passion of like Waterson emotions, but it's still there. Like, it's curious about emotions, and it feels them but it kind of

Kyle Pierce:

Yeah. But anyway, taking it back to Capricorn, just taking note of those two in terms of you know, I don't necessarily think of one as being more masculine. If anything, Capricorn seems

Bonnie May:

that's how I think of all of the planets now

Kyle Pierce:

I forced to like think about this. Oh, yeah, but I was like,

Bonnie May:

but With Hellenistic astrology, there's like a Yeah, a big emphasis on gender. Yeah. And so, yeah, I think like, right, like, right now I just finished a class called queering the planets

Bonnie May:

fall into more like I like these like, kind of masculine like clothing, like, like, what is associated with masculine, these movements are associated masculine versus like, feminine. And there

Kyle Pierce:

Yeah. Well, I think it's maybe worth like, as part of that is we sort of have to recognize how inconsistent our models for gender have been, historically, we have sort of a basis,

Kyle Pierce:

secure and be afraid all the time. That's like another coldness. Actually, I mean, the positive end of it is promotes thought before action. It's like birth is better at thinking before they act,

Bonnie May:

Yeah, looking at doing the doing the risk analysis, looking at your resources, saying like, what can you get away with? What What can you be risky about what you should be safe about?

Kyle Pierce:

Yeah. Once you get the different versions, I guess, if it's like, there's a bunch of different like, that's where I'm like, oh, yeah, I see. Because, you know, often women are more

Bonnie May:

men are statistics. The reason why women should be worried for their lives is like usually a significant other that's a man Yeah.

Kyle Pierce:

There Yeah, men are more responsible for most of the crime that happens they commit more violent crime, as it my international relations theory teacher, see asked everybody who thought

Bonnie May:

for sure, yeah, that's what we do. Yeah.

Kyle Pierce:

But that's changed a lot. And too, or there's just more, there's more for different expressions, I think.

Bonnie May:

Yeah, I think women are like, yeah. Also, like aware of danger in the same kind of way, but in a different kind of way. It's like, I don't want to be victimized. It's like being victimized

Kyle Pierce:

Yeah. Yeah. I feel self conscious about trying to speak on behalf of, of women. That's not my, just my observation, maybe but yeah, I don't know. It gets just thinking about Capricorn,

Bonnie May:

Yeah, actually, I maybe as a Capricorn rising, I think that, like my perception of Capricorn placements is that they're really good at providing but they also, sometimes they want

Kyle Pierce:

I'll just do what needs to be done. Because it's to be done. And like, you're not going to know how I feel about it. Because the assumption is that I don't have any feelings about it. They

Bonnie May:

Hmm, yeah. So I just like don't really use masculine and feminine that much for the signs anymore. Like it's in the back of my mind, but I usually switch it out to inward versus

Bonnie May:

it's like a feminine sign, like they're still masculine, but they do it in like a more introspective, quiet, kind of like, I'm in control, but I'm not going to flaunt it way. Versus like,

Bonnie May:

like, just like build up and explode or do you like let it trickle out like in a healthy kind of sustainable way. So I feel like more I've seen more like younger men, identifying people who are

Kyle Pierce:

Yeah. I would say as someone who's, you know, born male, and still identifies as male, but also like, um, a cancer rising, and yeah.

Bonnie May:

Bring it to cancer. Yeah.

Kyle Pierce:

The moon in like a water sign. And yeah, I would say that I definitely had the experience growing up of like, feeling like I had the this expectation, like having lots of emotions

Kyle Pierce:

acceptable. But the expectation for men I think has gone up. It's like, oh, yeah, yeah, you don't get to get away with being a dumbass. And like being emotionally oblivious to stuff anymore. Like we

Bonnie May:

Yeah, it's like, yeah, I think a lot of like, women, identifying people, and like queer people, especially, like help show us this of like, there's like healthier ways to be masculine or

Bonnie May:

thinking about how like, even though, like, usually, it's like men who are like kind of told to be closed off from their feelings, or at least like in the past, so it was like more how it was taught

Kyle Pierce:

That's a really good point. Actually, it's because it's not just, it's not just, you know, men that have to do this, or one that they do this, like, everybody's sort of oppressed by a

Bonnie May:

we're just like, going around circles and stuff going on. So we're just gonna give you some things to think about. We've

Kyle Pierce:

probably answered it. But I think that's part of the bargain. When you submit a question to astrology hotline is we'll answer your question, but we're going to talk about what

Bonnie May:

the answer is Daddy is a state of mind.

Kyle Pierce:

Like Capricorns a thing but is that specifically, you know, maybe the the idea of what daddy means something that is that changes or evolves. Um, And is maybe not explicitly relegated to

Kyle Pierce:

I want people to do that, too. Maybe it's my cancer. I see. But I, you know, I wanna be able to share in that as well to the degree that I can. Without overstepping, you know, there can be a sense

Bonnie May:

That's true. We're still I think we're still trying to navigate like, what is my sense of like, gender, sexuality, whatever it is, versus like what other people expect of me. And it's

Kyle Pierce:

Yeah. As much as I want to, like, fast forward to swear, I like the trap, maybe that I'm worried about falling into is that like, almost like the colorblind mentality, we're trying to

Bonnie May:

born with. Yeah, I think I think it can be gender can be useful in the way that people want to define themselves. But yeah, the difference is now we want more of a less rigid, kind of

Kyle Pierce:

Yeah, and I guess it can only speak to my own experience of maybe having to, to learn looking for wrestle with maybe the ways that I didn't fit into what I felt like my expectations were

Kyle Pierce:

And you don't necessarily have to use masculine or feminine

Bonnie May:

no you don't I don't think for any of them you need to

Kyle Pierce:

think it's like a descendant almost not being a super useful construction because it I don't know.

Bonnie May:

Yeah, I think that's like what we're seeing right now with like, studying astrology and like also like, you know, more information about like, like traditional astrology emerging and us

Kyle Pierce:

Yeah, absolutely. I guess maybe for more on that, you know, check out the symposium.

Bonnie May:

And if you are interested in more like queer astrology talk, oh yeah, I'm co facilitating at Star dance Mystery School. We're on Patreon. But we teach live classes. We teach

Kyle Pierce:

Next question. Second question. today comes from Mikayla. And Michaela writes, I was told that because I don't have a stellium, that I would have a hard time finding direction in life.

Bonnie May:

yeah, you don't want it? Yeah, who told her that? I started them.

Kyle Pierce:

And this is something I don't know. It's like, you go into forums and stuff, and you get so many ideas. And I love it when you're just treating them like ideas. But unfortunately, I

Bonnie May:

I think that's absolutely I agree. That's not That's not what it means. Do you want to like kind of define, like, what we're talking about selling them? And that way, we can give a little

Kyle Pierce:

Yeah, so Well, there's different even definitions of stallions. I guess my definition of the stellium is that it's a word that we use to describe having three or more planets in a given

Bonnie May:

differentiate between inner and outer planets, like our inner

Kyle Pierce:

and outer planets, points, maybe don't count or, you know, nodes, do they count? Do do asteroids count. And I have a in my mind, but it feels to me like a very simple answer is like,

Kyle Pierce:

you're I don't know maybe not maybe you're missing out on a free phrase, listen, you a appropriate way.

Bonnie May:

I think. I think like what that those kind of like answers like oh, like, it means you have no focus in your life. It's just like, kind of like an easy answer to give someone where it's

Bonnie May:

aspects, all of that matters. It's all web. Like there's no like one focal point that's like, here's the bullseye like this is where you go, it's all going to kind of inter woven with each other. Yeah.

Kyle Pierce:

Yeah, I think that's yeah, that. And I think maybe the reverse, like assuming that you don't have planets, if you have many planets, and if you've planned spread out across your chart and

Bonnie May:

Yeah. Variety is good, like having a, like, I have a stellium. And I think it's a pain in the ass.

Kyle Pierce:

Yeah. Yeah. And that's, I guess that's tends to be my picky too. It's still insisted. Yeah, maybe they represent a concentration of energy or little too much of life experience in a

Bonnie May:

Yeah. Yeah. And it's hard to say like, oh, what should be the focus of your life? Like, I think people can have multiple focuses, like, there might be a few particular things that they're

Kyle Pierce:

Which I wouldn't necessarily look to a stellium to answer specific questions on that. Maybe, I mean, maybe, but I would look at other factors around the concentration.

Bonnie May:

Like, maybe the sun if that's in the stellium. But yeah,

Kyle Pierce:

and yeah, and actually, it's a good point, because, you know, it was it was like a point in Vedic Astrology that got me thinking about it. Is that like, certain planets don't

Bonnie May:

wait my moon. Yeah, it's it's the only planet it sign but it's making aspects. It's making it Yeah, it is making us but it's not totally lonely. But it is like the only planet it's

Kyle Pierce:

Yeah, maybe it's useful to define when the moon is Yeah, cuz I

Bonnie May:

cuz I'm thinking of like blowing Moon as it's like a moon not making any aspects to anything. So maybe,

Kyle Pierce:

yeah, yeah. That's what I tend to lean on. Like the Vedic definition is. The moon is in a sign without another planet, and without any other planets in the sign right after it. Were right

Bonnie May:

have the North Node in Aries. Well, that wouldn't count. And I have Chiron in Gemini, so I guess both of those don't count. They wouldn't count with Vedic Astrology. Yeah. Yeah.

Kyle Pierce:

I mean, technically my wins with Pluto. Great.

Bonnie May:

Oh, that's right. I think of what you have. Yeah. Pluto. And so Pluto would that would that count?

Kyle Pierce:

Right now? Probably not a definition. For the Western? Yeah, it's it. interpretively makes sense there's but then even in the Vedic approach, there's mitigations to it, where you know

Bonnie May:

Or I've wondered about that too, if like planets being under the beams of the sun, because in traditional astrology that is like a thing. But since Mercury and Venus do travel pretty

Kyle Pierce:

Yeah. I mean, I think it depends a lot on the sun. So I sort of my going interpretation is like the sun is use this in the last episode, but like the sun is like a boss that will like talk

Bonnie May:

Yeah, what I was thinking. I was kind of thinking the other planets being more annoyed being near the Sun, like, Oh, it's so hot. Exactly. Yeah. And so loud.

Kyle Pierce:

Yeah. And what planets? Yeah. And like, some planets may enjoy the company of other planets more, you know, may enjoy sharing a sign with, like, Venus might enjoy sharing the sign with

Bonnie May:

Mars. Right? I was thinking the moon and the Mars probably are not very

Kyle Pierce:

Moon and Mars probably when like, yeah, yeah. So I guess, maybe the point is that there's so many other things to consider when interpreting planets that are in the same sign, and

Bonnie May:

I was actually thinking about how, like, one thing in traditional astrology, I can see why people think that, you know, having a stellium gives you this much focus is that like, if you're

Kyle Pierce:

Yeah. But that's also maybe another important point. It's like, yeah, actually, but both of our sort of, I don't know three planets is considered a stellium I know some people say four

Bonnie May:

months four, if you count Pluto. Yeah. Yeah. Which I mean, what three if it's personal, which is some people would count Yeah, so I count Yeah. I basically just kind of like the outer

Kyle Pierce:

But I mean I guess the the defining a stellium in all the things the energy we put into like debating maybe yeah defines a stellium or not really only serves the purpose of like, getting

Bonnie May:

No, it's just yeah, for me it's just kind of distracting sometimes. But it I also do I think I do personally feel a pressure of like looking at my chart and be like, Oh, I have so much

Bonnie May:

should look at the North Node. Maybe I should look at Mars for like, things I want. You know, that just kind of depends on like, how we're defining purpose.

Kyle Pierce:

Yeah. One? That's a really good point, actually. Because I think there is like, almost like an impulse to like, want to look for one placement or one thing to tell us the answer to this.

Bonnie May:

yeah, going back to pop astrology in the sun sign? Yeah. Being that used to be more of a common thing of like, Oh, your son is who you are. That's it. That's all you have?

Kyle Pierce:

Are you people like wanting to know, like, Okay, I want to know what my, what my future husband is going to look like? What color hairs my future is gonna look like? Where do I look in the

Bonnie May:

Yeah, people miss it, though. I go, I used to be just the sun sign. And I knew I knew who it was. Now I'm confused. And yeah, I think that's like, that's another thing of astrology is

Bonnie May:

this is who you are, you have to also like, work with it and see, like, Does this feel true for me? And how does it show up in my life? So it's like, it's I don't know, it's like a way of

Kyle Pierce:

Absolutely. One in you know, do you want to like, have the chart write the story for you? Or do you want to have some direction with the story, you know, which I you know, if you're

Bonnie May:

Oh, that's so meta. I love it.

Kyle Pierce:

And what that I mean, this is the deeper question is in like, traditional astrology would just identify you as basically the ascendant. Yes. And all the other planets, the planets are

Bonnie May:

I can totally see that because I feel like with all the different houses and signs, and like the planets there, it's like, I feel like a Capricorn rising. But then when I'm in a different

Kyle Pierce:

Yeah. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. I think at the end of the day, we're all we're using metaphors, like these are all just metaphors, for describing something. It's really hard to

Kyle Pierce:

yeah, pluck stellium. And I will say objective that, from my point of view that still names don't point to specifically in and of themselves, good or bad things.

Bonnie May:

Yeah, and I agree with that. Yeah, we have two astrologers that have stellium saying, fuck stallions.

Kyle Pierce:

I don't think it's considered a stone. It's only 333 planets. That's true. I've thrown Capricorn but they're two of them are outer planets.

Bonnie May:

Yeah, minor. Three personal planets and one outer. So depending on your definition, yeah. Might not count.

Kyle Pierce:

I don't feel bad about myself for not having a Yeah, it's like,

Bonnie May:

it's just easier to say stellium or not, but you know, it doesn't really matter.

Kyle Pierce:

It sounds cool. Yeah. All right. Well, I guess we can wrap it up for today, then. Yeah. How? How can people find you? What do you got going on, Barney?

Bonnie May:

Sure. I on Instagram and Twitter. I made a astrology so I'm not doing readings yet. I'm still taking time to study but you can find me with star dance Mystery School. We're on Patreon and

Kyle Pierce:

Sounds great. What's the

Bonnie May:

star dance mysteries, our

Kyle Pierce:

dance mystery school,

Bonnie May:

but also just like hit me up on Instagram because I like chatting with people. Yeah.

Kyle Pierce:

Yeah, you actually are like one of the best people for just like you are always up for chatting. And I always feel guilty because I'm like, may or may not be able to chat. Go back because

Bonnie May:

I'm doing Tuesday nights from like, 830 to 1030 doing like

Kyle Pierce:

the sort of the readings, sort of like little, little,

Bonnie May:

little mini readings lately, I've had a lot of people that want to learn astrology, and they've just been like, basically, I'll just like, start talking about whatever tangent I'm studying

Kyle Pierce:

chance. Oh, yeah. And it's great practice. Practice a great way of learning. It's like, actually hearing people's stories, being willing to listen to what they have to say about their

Bonnie May:

been very eye opening and also just thinking about like, like, what I'm reading, like, how do I explain it to people and like, how do I define it to them? Because it's like a really good

Kyle Pierce:

Not a word. I really hear much outside Yeah, I

Bonnie May:

guess I interpretations. But leaving it kind of open but not so vague. Like that's the tricky part with like, being on Twitch like, I don't want to make this so vague. It's just like

Kyle Pierce:

Yeah, that's, I have a choice. advertise this. I do have every week. There's one slot available to To book a call up research, reading, where it's basically I get to ask you questions

Bonnie May:

Yeah, it's a different approach. It makes it better, I think. I think that's really cool. Because like, like you said, like the idea of having preconceived notions like as like an

Kyle Pierce:

I'll even have like a list of just like, Alright, does. Do you experience this? Do you experience this? Do you experience this? I won't necessarily do that. But it just depends on

Bonnie May:

little bit, especially if it's like a really interesting or unique placement. It's like, oh, it's

Kyle Pierce:

like, yeah, yeah, I

Bonnie May:

think that's, that's very Scorpios like collecting all the information, like all the research.

Kyle Pierce:

Yeah. And it's fun, and people have gotten a lot out of it, too. So you know, you can do that you can also book regular reading with me. And we also got a flood. Oh, yeah. at Pembroke,

Bonnie May:

I think this has been very similar. Yeah, but I'm gonna check out that podcast.

Kyle Pierce:

Um, and then of course, check out read becoming the one will be awesome. But yeah. Thanks so much for joining me today, Bonnie. Yeah. And, yeah, always welcome on the show. And then

Bonnie May:

You have a question that you would like to have answered on astrology hotline. Send us an email at astrology hotline@gmail.com.

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Astrology Hotline
The Podcast that Answers All Your Burning Birth Chart and Astrology Questions
Astrology Hotline is the podcast that answers all your burning birth chart and astrology questions. Hosted by astrologer Kyle Pierce, the show provides an open forum for listeners to have their questions answered and facilitate discussions about a broad range of topics with guests including some of astrology's most up-and-coming astrologers. Whatever it is that has you stumped when it comes to astrology or your birth chart, Astrology Hotline is here to get you the answers your looking for. Send us your questions at astrologyhotlinepod@gmail.com.

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Kyle Pierce

Kyle Pierce is a Professional Astrologer with an inclusive approach based primarily on Hellenistic techniques. He lives in Michigan.